00:00
Hola. I'm Claudia Romo Elman and I'm Cynthia Kleinbaum Miller and
00:04
a La Latina, the playbook to succeed being your authentic self
00:08
Today, we're gonna learn from Laurie Castillo Martinez.
00:11
A couple of important points.
00:13
First careers are long taking a step back,
00:17
won't ruin your success.
00:19
Even lateral moves can be beneficial.
00:21
The importance of reference,
00:23
mentors and sponsors and how to maintain those relationships.
00:27
Also the business case for inclusive teams and the correlation between diverse
00:32
teams and improved performance.
00:33
Lastly, you will learn how to approach an interview process to
00:38
in an inclusive environment where you can be yourself all of that
00:42
and more here. A La Latina stick around Hola.
00:54
Welcome to this podcast,
00:56
a La Latina, the playbook to succeed being your authentic self
01:00
today. Laurie Castillo Martinez.
01:03
Laurie is the Executive Vice president and Chief Equality Officer at Sales
01:07
Force. She's a board member of how women lead and life
01:10
moves and she's a senior fellow at the American Leadership Forum in
01:14
Silicon Valley. Welcome,
01:15
Laurie. It's a pleasure having you here.
01:17
Oh, thank you for having me.
01:18
I'm so looking forward to our conversation today.
01:21
Ok. So, Cynthia and I were king.
01:23
we're doing research and trying,
01:25
like, trying to prepare for,
01:27
for today and we found actually a lot of information about your
01:31
about your corporate roles and about your opinion about
01:34
the companies that you were representing,
01:36
but we were not able to find a lot about you.
01:40
well, it has a lot to do with the career I've
01:43
chosen. I spent a lot of my career in the compliance
01:46
and ethics in corporate investigation space.
01:48
And so before I took the leap into this role of Chief
01:51
Equality Officer, I actually used to search the internet and make
01:55
sure I was not on there.
02:00
will tell me when I first took on this role,
02:02
I, I literally only had about 16 followers 16.
02:06
So we have been working on you know,
02:09
how we really think about all of the topics related to equality
02:12
my own professional career and what I can share and
02:17
And I think today's podcast is a great opportunity to,
02:19
to do that. It's so interesting is literally making the effort
02:23
to be like to move from invisible to visible.
02:26
And the reason why we wanted to ask you and start with
02:28
that is because we think that for a number of Latinas,
02:32
we we don't dare to actually put ourselves out there
02:35
We don't want to talk about our stories because we don't
02:37
think that there are important or we feel exposed.
02:40
And so because we're trying to elevate the profile of of
02:44
Latinos in general and make sure that Latinos feel comfortable sharing their
02:48
you know, like their stories so that they can be
02:50
seen, heard and valued.
02:52
It's interesting to know that you had a,
02:55
you had a, you had a reason.
02:57
So let's let's get the world to know who you are.
03:01
We, we would love to learn about your upbringing.
03:04
How did you grow up?
03:05
Also? Can you tell us things from your childhood,
03:08
from your, from your teenage years that then prepare you for
03:11
the role that you have now?
03:12
So I grew up in San Jose,
03:14
California and my parents also from the Bay Area.
03:19
the two most informative things were one,
03:22
I went to an all girls high school and when you go
03:25
to an all girls high school,
03:26
you really learn that women rule the world.
03:29
And that's what I thought when I left high school.
03:32
It was also a very diverse high school,
03:34
many Latinas, Filipinas and just a very diverse environment where I
03:40
really learned how to be myself.
03:43
And I was able to sort of center on who I wanted
03:46
to be. It was a very safe space.
03:48
I always tell them if you have daughters you know,
03:51
all girls schools are,
03:52
I'm a huge fan because I just feel like it,
03:54
it brought a different perspective to it.
03:57
And then sports, I played sports and again,
04:00
in an all girls environment,
04:02
everybody comes to cheer for your sports.
04:04
It's a little different kind of dynamic.
04:07
And then I would say the other thing and,
04:09
and really, you know,
04:10
from a perspective of my family,
04:15
every event, every moment I had my extended family there.
04:19
And I think that support to that community engagement.
04:23
It really just gave me the confidence so that when I
04:26
went off into the world and whether it was through university or
04:30
I felt that security of family and I felt that security
04:34
of team and just having been in places where I could grow
04:38
that, that confidence,
04:40
I love that like having the,
04:41
the confidence coming from your family.
04:43
Like if there, there's nothing more Latino than extended family,
04:47
going to cheer you up and having the theos and the tias
04:51
and whether they are blood related or not and be becoming references
04:55
right? Like I think that that's where you're saying you
04:58
you grew up in an environment of safety where you had references
05:01
and probably mentors were an extension of that.
05:04
And you were able to ask for mentors that were all the
05:07
way in through your life.
05:09
I'd like to dig into that concept of references,
05:13
mentors and sponsors. How was it in your life?
05:16
What role did they play?
05:18
How did you ask for them?
05:20
And then we can transition onto a little deeper on what
05:23
does it mean to be a mentor?
05:24
What does it mean to be a sponsor?
05:25
And how do you ask for them?
05:26
How do you prepare for,
05:27
you know, having a mentor and being mentored properly?
05:31
if I go back to the theme of family,
05:33
it really started there where it was my dad and my
05:39
I always had this sort of space where I could ask these
05:41
kinds of questions. Now,
05:42
my parents didn't grow up in corporations.
05:45
And so they didn't have that experience necessarily,
05:48
but education was very important and they made sure that there were
05:52
those connections. And my sister is 13 years older than
05:55
me. And so she was the first in our family to
05:58
go to university. And so she was the one who was
06:01
able to really share some of her learnings 13 years ahead of
06:05
me and connect me with her friends.
06:08
And, and it was actually through that again,
06:10
that broader community, one of her friends connect me to my
06:13
very first corporate jobs at Intel where she said,
06:18
go in, this is how you,
06:20
this is, these are the things you want to do to
06:21
prepare even down to this is the outfit you want to wear
06:25
like all of those small nuances that,
06:29
you know, I may not necessarily would have received.
06:33
but it was somebody that was helping me think through it
06:36
And so when I think about mentors,
06:38
it starts there. But as I think about it from more
06:42
And today, my role today,
06:43
mentors are very much about who do you need in that moment
06:49
you know, if you know about sales force,
06:51
it's all things A I right now.
06:53
Well, A I technology from that perspective is not something I've
06:57
spent a lot of time on.
06:58
And so I've been finding sponsors or sorry,
07:01
mentors for myself that can help teach me the technology.
07:04
I have other mentors that are helping me navigate maybe specific situations
07:09
When I was new in this job,
07:11
finding mentors who are experts in de and I,
07:14
that could be my partners or personal board of directors that can
07:17
help me be successful in this role.
07:19
And then when I think of the sponsors in my career,
07:22
these are the folks and I always think the best sponsor is
07:25
somebody that's two levels above you because this is somebody that's in
07:29
the room when decisions like promotions or assignments are being made.
07:33
And, and I say two levels because at two levels,
07:36
they can look across the organization,
07:38
you have people who can see not just in your narrow organization
07:42
but across maybe a broader segment.
07:45
And, and those are the folks that in my career have
07:48
helped me find new opportunities,
07:51
whether it was an international assignment or moving out of hr
07:56
into finance or out of finance,
07:58
into compliance and ethics.
07:59
It was those sponsors who were able to see those next jobs
08:03
and those next opportunities,
08:04
who would say things to me like you get on well
08:07
with the lawyers. How about you go try a hand in
08:09
compliance and ethics and it was not something I'd spent any time
08:13
in. And so it was those new opportunities that came to
08:15
those sponsors and, and just that openness of connecting with people
08:19
that helped, I'd like to ask you a little bit more
08:21
about the mentors. Sure,
08:23
because a little bit being a little selfish,
08:27
I think I've messed up many of my mentorship relationships by like
08:30
not knowing how to start that relationship or how to keep the
08:34
relationship. So can you tell us,
08:36
like, how do you reach out to somebody that you want
08:39
that person to be your mentor?
08:40
How, how do you manage the ongoing relationship?
08:43
Do you ever break up with them because they're no longer,
08:47
like, useful? I don't want to say that.
08:49
But like, so I think the first thing is,
08:50
I think every mentor I've had,
08:52
I've met through somebody else.
08:54
And I think that's one of the interesting things that's really
08:58
important whether early career,
08:59
mid career or even towards the end of your career,
09:03
I think, making sure you're investing in your network,
09:05
who are the people that like,
09:08
again, I always try to think what's the job I want
09:11
two jobs from now or what's the work I need to do
09:14
in the next quarter or two?
09:16
And where are those resources?
09:18
Where are those people that I can help or can help me
09:22
And so because to me,
09:23
mentorship is a mutual relationship.
09:25
And so I think being thoughtful about where and how you connect
09:29
with people has been really important.
09:32
And so I think you can do it through formal programs and
09:35
we definitely have those where you can fill out skills sheets and
09:39
we have algorithms that match people and can bring them together.
09:43
And then to your point,
09:44
sometimes people click and sometimes we don't.
09:46
And so we try to set up in a way that,
09:49
if it's not a relationship that clicks,
09:51
everybody can gracefully walk away,
09:53
it's great. But if it clicks,
09:55
then it's somebody that again,
09:57
you want to keep up that relationship with.
09:58
But I think the best ones are the mentors that I've met
10:01
through others or through my networks are showing up at activities where
10:05
I can seek people out,
10:06
do my homework ahead of time and find the people that I
10:09
want to meet. And then to your point about how do
10:12
you keep up the relationships?
10:13
For me, it's a couple of different ways.
10:15
I have some mentors where we send each other articles.
10:18
We might not talk on a regular basis but we want to
10:20
keep the relationship warm.
10:21
And so I know what their interests are and so I might
10:26
I know you're doing,
10:27
you're the latest research on this topic.
10:29
Let me send you something I just saw in,
10:31
in this media article of that.
10:33
And then there's others where maybe it's somebody I'm going into
10:39
how's it going? We haven't connected in a couple of quarters
10:42
I'm going to be in town,
10:43
let's find a moment to connect.
10:46
And then I would say on the more formal side
10:51
where I really like the A I,
10:53
I'll use that one as an example because it's very present is
10:56
there's some specific learnings I want to gain and then there's some
10:59
things that I want to make sure from the quality perspective,
11:02
I'm contributing to the A I story around inclusion and you know
11:07
our battle against bias.
11:09
And so in that case,
11:10
there's very specific objectives,
11:12
very specific conversations and very specific partners that I'm meeting with on
11:16
a regular basis. So I guess all of that to say
11:18
it's a very wide gamut and the most important thing as an
11:21
individual is to know what you want out of it and to
11:24
do the homework in preparation.
11:27
I have further questions on this one because I think that a
11:31
there's the rules of the game that you don't know what you
11:35
don't know. And so in order to create a plan so
11:38
that you can ask a mentor to guide you into certain things
11:40
you should know what you want.
11:42
And sometimes we don't even know that.
11:44
And there's that piece,
11:46
I think that, you know,
11:47
like it would be interesting just to break down a bit more
11:50
So there are rules of the game that we should know
11:53
about so that we can play the game.
11:55
What are the things that we could do or that you have
11:57
done to see what you don't know and to understand rules that
12:02
you don't even know that they exist.
12:04
Yeah, II, I can use it.
12:06
Maybe I can share an example of a couple of things that
12:08
happened to me. So I was at a company
12:12
and I was doing my first presentation to senior leadership and I
12:16
you know, as we get more senior and at every level
12:19
there's to your point,
12:20
there's all these unwritten rules and I was going into an environment
12:25
where it wasn't going to be in the office,
12:26
it was going to be at a resort.
12:29
I was going to be presenting for about 30 minutes.
12:32
But what I didn't know was that,
12:36
this is a very casual time when the leaders get together
12:40
you know, a West coast company but this was a meeting
12:43
that was going to be on the east coast.
12:47
and, and so there was these nuances about style approach,
12:52
even down to the kinds of shoes that I wore and,
12:55
and, and the reason I say that is because so the
12:58
the leader at the time,
13:00
she was a sponsor of mine and and a mentor
13:03
and what she said to me and she said,
13:04
Laurie, this is going to be a very odd thing to
13:06
say. But what are you going to wear?
13:09
And at first I was a little taken aback because like,
13:11
why is she asking me what I'm going to wear?
13:12
Like is this she judging me?
13:14
Like, do I not look professional?
13:16
And I think she could see the look on my face.
13:18
no, no. What you can't be is all San Francisco
13:20
We're going to a different part of the country,
13:23
the culture, the norms are slightly different.
13:25
We're in resort wear.
13:27
You need to figure out like think Hamptons think Cape Cod think
13:34
I kind of looked at her and went,
13:36
ok, I'm not sure I know exactly what you mean.
13:38
And she said come around come around,
13:40
let's look on the internet.
13:41
And so we did this was probably,
13:42
I don't know, 15 years ago,
13:43
but we sort of went around,
13:45
we looked at her laptop and she's,
13:47
and so we go through this whole thing we talk about,
13:49
you know what I'm gonna do.
13:50
And then she said to me,
13:52
she said, the reason I'm doing this is because you're walking
13:55
into a room of mostly men.
13:58
And she said, and I've seen other women show up and
14:01
they show up in their San Francisco suits and heels and she
14:05
said, we're at the beach and they're all going to be
14:08
in shorts and polo shirts and,
14:10
and she said, and I've seen,
14:12
you know, women walk in and they're trying to walk on
14:14
the beach in the sand with their heels and they're,
14:16
you know, and everybody's more distracted by what they're wearing then
14:21
what they're saying. And she said,
14:23
I want them to hear what you have to say.
14:25
So let's just get this part out of the way.
14:27
And I would say the theme of the story is they tell
14:29
you when there are things that can distract from your message that
14:34
you don't even know about.
14:37
it was the casual nature of the meeting versus the formality that
14:41
this company was known for.
14:43
And so it was sort of flipping that script of,
14:45
I know normally you show up in a suit,
14:48
but I'm, this is a place where you have permission to
14:51
show up differently and I don't want you to go status quo
14:56
and have that, you know,
14:58
not set you up for success.
15:00
And so I think for me,
15:01
the, the place when these conversations happen,
15:04
when you have a trusted relationship.
15:07
it's how do you build that trusted relationship is where you
15:12
start to get some of these unwritten rules.
15:15
and people willing to share with you because talking to somebody
15:19
about what they're wearing can also again,
15:22
like I said, it can be a little jarring if it's
15:24
not somebody that there's mutual trust.
15:26
And so I think in these relationships,
15:28
the point is to make sure you have that mutual trust because
15:31
that's when you start to get those great nuggets of the,
15:33
the unwritten rules. And it's almost like,
15:37
it's like you want to ask a question,
15:40
you don't know which question to ask,
15:42
right? Like you would have never set up an agenda for
15:45
that sponsor, have a call with the sponsor and ask the
15:48
sponsor, what should I wear?
15:50
So it's that relationship and that maybe,
15:53
like just talking about anything and then suddenly you're talking about
15:57
this event and then,
15:58
and then she tells you that and at least what we were
16:01
talking about with Eliana in our previous recording is that we want
16:06
the next generation to get to where we are in half the
16:09
time. But the only way that that can happen is if
16:11
they learn from us and not from doing because if you don't
16:15
have the mentor, then the way that you are the sponsor
16:18
the way that you would have learned that is by going
16:22
messing up the first time and then the second time you would
16:26
this time I have my Hamptons clothing.
16:30
it's important to put the time on building relationships and not having
16:35
them be so transactional that you think you have all the questions
16:38
because if you don't know what to ask,
16:39
you're not going to get the answer.
16:41
Yeah. And I think the important part of the trust is
16:44
being willing, coming prepared,
16:46
but also being vulnerable.
16:48
So one of the things that I've done and I learned early
16:51
in my career is what else do I need to know to
16:53
be prepared as a question I always ask?
16:58
help me understand what other successful presenters have done.
17:03
Can you give me feedback?
17:04
You've seen me present before?
17:07
I'm presenting to a new audience or there's things that I do
17:10
that you think will resonate best with this audience or things that
17:15
And so I think also showing up as a mentee or as
17:19
a spons with an attitude of openness and willingness to learn,
17:24
I think that's created the conditions by which people felt more comfortable
17:28
sharing some of that feedback.
17:29
And so I think that's a really,
17:31
sometimes we want to come up so buttoned up and so formal
17:35
our mentors and sponsors sometimes don't want to crush us or
17:39
don't want to tell us something that maybe they feel is going
17:42
to break our confidence.
17:43
And so it's, it's finding ways to ask those questions of
17:48
of those mentors and sponsors so that they know you're open
17:52
And that because they want to help you,
17:54
Everybody wants to help when they're,
17:56
when they volunteer to be a sponsor or a mentor or when
17:59
you're building those relationships.
18:00
And so I always think about how do I make it easy
18:03
for them to help me and how do I create those conditions
18:06
for us to build that trust?
18:07
You have mentioned something you haven't used the word,
18:10
but it's a hot word lately.
18:12
The reverse mentorship and you,
18:15
you're basically saying also mentorship goes both ways.
18:18
Now people say A CEO has to have a young mentor to
18:23
tell them how to use social media or how to think about
18:26
A I, you didn't use the words,
18:28
but I think you were a pioneer in the reverse mentorship.
18:31
You should have coined the word.
18:33
We would like to know more about your role as diversity and
18:38
inclusion within one of the largest tech companies in the world.
18:43
How is it, what are the programs that work?
18:45
What are the objectives and just like driving the mentorship and the
18:48
sponsorship program are those kind of like the best practices on making
18:53
sure that people get,
18:56
feel integrated, have a sense of belonging a little bit,
18:59
just like just like to close down the loop of mentorship and
19:02
sponsorship with corporations. How do you do it from your perspective
19:05
as a leader of sales force?
19:07
Sure. So I think it's part of it is understanding
19:11
what goals you're trying to achieve,
19:12
right? Because I think mentorship and sponsorship are tools or approaches
19:18
but it it depends on what you as the individual are
19:20
looking for and whether or not a mentorship or sponsorship or maybe
19:24
another program is the right answer for you.
19:27
And so what we try to do is leverage our data to
19:31
what is, what is the objective we're trying to meet here
19:34
And so if someone is trying to look for their next
19:37
career opportunity, if we use that as an example,
19:40
that's something that comes up for Latinas.
19:42
quite a lot in our organization,
19:44
how do I navigate my career?
19:46
So if I think about that,
19:47
that goal of how do I navigate my career.
19:50
We talk about two paths.
19:52
So the mentorship path,
19:53
we have a, a tool called mentor finder where anybody in
19:56
the company can sign up to be mentors and anybody in the
19:59
company can look for both mentors and mentees.
20:04
And so that's something that anybody in the company can do
20:08
And we've got some technology that helps us do that
20:10
And then we have specialized programs through our business resource groups
20:14
and through our office where again we can do more formal matching
20:17
depending on the goals that the individual has sponsorship.
20:21
I want to talk about a little bit because I think that's
20:23
something that it's taken us a little while to unpack.
20:26
How, how do we set up a framework again?
20:28
How do we create those conditions for sponsorship in a company?
20:31
Because it's a really special relationship.
20:35
And to your point earlier,
20:36
it can be one that it's hard to figure it out,
20:40
right? Because somebody has a sponsor,
20:41
you're also putting your political capital on the table,
20:44
you're using your leverage,
20:46
your credibility. And so I also think sometimes people are quite
20:49
reticent to be sponsors until they really know the person.
20:53
And so what we've done is we have a program called Amplify
20:56
if I use this as one example.
20:58
And what we've tried to do is figure out what are all
21:00
the different dimensions of sponsorship.
21:04
how do you find the right matches?
21:06
And so we're very intentional about creating a cohort.
21:09
This last cohort we had as women of color.
21:12
We then figured out,
21:15
their goals? So which departments do they want to move to
21:19
are there leaders that they want to connect with.
21:21
And then we went out and actually asked and invited a
21:27
very specific cohort of sponsors to join this program.
21:30
And so we had an amazing team of sponsors,
21:32
amazing team of SPONSEES.
21:34
And then we created a program by which we had different opportunities
21:39
for them to work together.
21:40
Because the important thing about being a sponsor is again before you're
21:44
sort of moving forward and,
21:45
and recommending or talking about someone you want to see them in
21:49
action. And so this program created an opportunity for them to
21:53
actually work together on a project that our CEO team put together
21:58
for them. And so it created again this environment and then
22:01
also what was really important was engaging their managers because we want
22:05
to make sure their managers know where they want their career.
22:08
So the managers and the sponsors can work together to help people's
22:11
careers move forward. So that's just a small example of a
22:13
way that we can pull it together.
22:15
I've never heard of a sponsorship like structure sponsorship program because as
22:20
you said, it's like you're putting your,
22:24
your credibility when you,
22:25
it's not like I'm giving you a recommendation as a mentor.
22:28
It's more like I'm taking you with me in my own growth
22:33
I think in sales force,
22:34
you guys are doing very innovative.
22:36
Thank you. At least from,
22:38
from what I was when I was doing research on you,
22:41
everyone should be doing these things.
22:43
We've tried to be thoughtful and learn.
22:46
I think that's the key and the role of the manager,
22:49
the role of the sponsor,
22:50
the role of the employee,
22:51
right? You own your own employability as an employee as well
22:54
And I think the best scenarios is when you have those
22:56
folks working together towards that common career goal that the person has
23:00
designed or is thinking through for themselves.
23:04
And this sales force just doing it because they want to
23:07
be good people, good citizens of the world or what is
23:12
the business equation for all of this?
23:14
Well, I think for us its sales force.
23:16
So equality is part of our DNA.
23:18
And, and what I would say is we're very unique in
23:20
that. It's den I for us is not a that sits
23:24
on the side, it's equality is a value of the company
23:27
It's one of our core values.
23:29
And so you see it permeated throughout the company.
23:33
And what I think of my office is we figure out where
23:35
and how do we accelerate it,
23:37
you know, where are the ways that we can bring greater
23:39
equity? How do we leverage our data to better understand
23:43
ways we can increase representation,
23:45
retention experience. Our,
23:47
our strategy really cuts across.
23:49
We want to make sure that we're thinking about representation,
23:53
which in tech is very challenging history and we want to make
23:57
sure that we're being intentional and how we move it forward.
24:00
So we have goals that we tie to executive compensation as an
24:02
example as it relates to representation.
24:05
But then we want to make sure that we think about experience
24:08
and I think experience is the hardest thing to tackle in a
24:10
corporation because it's so individual and especially if you're a first or
24:15
an only, it's really difficult to create that inclusive environment.
24:19
And so we try to be really thoughtful about where,
24:23
how are there other ways we can create that inclusion and that
24:26
safety for our teams.
24:28
And I think that's something that is a perpetual way that we
24:31
we continue to focus.
24:33
And then it's about how do we I believe that
24:36
every person day can decide whether or not they're creating an inclusive
24:41
environment. It doesn't have to be leaders,
24:43
it doesn't have to be,
24:44
you know, you and me,
24:47
you know, your manager,
24:48
I'm the only one who can create an inclusive environment.
24:51
It's everybody that we work with.
24:53
And so one of the things that we do to measure this
24:56
again, from a company perspective is we know there's a
24:59
very close tie between our most inclusive teams and performance.
25:03
And so we have an inclusion index that we put into our
25:06
employee survey twice a year and we then measure that against performance
25:11
And so, for example,
25:12
we know our most inclusive teams in our sales organization have 12%
25:17
better sales attainment and who doesn't want better sales attainment.
25:21
with sales force, we talk about values,
25:23
drive value. And this is another way where through our volunteer
25:28
time off, through our employee resource groups,
25:32
through all of these different again angles,
25:35
we can then create the experiences that,
25:38
you know, really drive us to be the most inclusive company
25:41
which ultimately helps our business be more successful.
25:45
We also see this is a great opportunity where we can
25:48
lock arms and go together with our,
25:50
our partners and our customers.
25:51
As we're all trying to make a difference in their communities.
25:55
I think it's very important for you to be like saying this
26:00
message and telling everyone and I'm going to make it my own
26:04
to be telling everyone because not every company has the resources of
26:07
sales force to track it.
26:09
And I have found that some executives think,
26:13
oh, that only works in big companies in smaller companies.
26:16
The performance is not better like that.
26:19
It's in big companies,
26:21
the kool aid, you drink the kool aid and you think
26:22
that inclusion drives results and we should all use your data to
26:27
it's going to work in tech but it's going to work in
26:29
retail, it's going to work in consumer goods and not everybody
26:33
will have the the budget to go and measure and have like
26:38
data driven decisions. But if you like spread the message if
26:43
we spread the message and everybody can use the same,
26:45
the same insights. So thank you,
26:46
of course. And it's not perfect.
26:48
I mean, no company is perfect.
26:50
But what we try to do is is have that beginner's mind
26:53
so that we're continuing to learn and figure out how to
26:56
adapt to your exact point,
26:58
what might work for one company might might not work for another
27:00
but it but there may be certain elements or framing.
27:04
And so things like our inclusion index,
27:05
we share, we say these are the six core questions that
27:08
are important to us,
27:10
those might work for you or to your point,
27:11
maybe there's something else that you would focus on based on,
27:14
you know, your business and your priorities.
27:16
And again, how you measure prior performance looks different in an
27:20
engineering organization than it might look in a sales organization.
27:23
And so again, being able to just be open and have
27:26
those conversations, you don't have to be an expert.
27:29
That's, that's really just knowing your business and knowing what's important
27:32
to you that, that I have like 20 followers.
27:37
like I think that what is important to know and I would
27:40
love to hear whether that's true for you is that you have
27:44
to go and take the big bet because what you're saying is
27:47
like, you cannot just think that you have a department that
27:51
can do two little leap service things and it's going to drive
27:54
results because it seems to me that what you said is a
27:57
360 that is coming top down,
28:00
that is embraced all across that has bonus attached to it that
28:04
has performance attached to it,
28:06
like a results measurement attached to it.
28:09
So at the end of the day,
28:10
I think that if you're going to do it,
28:11
you just have to do it properly to get the,
28:14
to get the results that you're having.
28:15
Is that correct? That's correct.
28:17
That's correct. It's,
28:19
it's, you have to think about the whole system
28:22
I mean, that's really,
28:23
you, you can't really solve it through one program.
28:26
I think of programs help us accelerate in certain areas where maybe
28:30
we want to drive retention or we want to drive hiring or
28:34
you know, they programs have a purpose.
28:37
But I think to really have the impact,
28:38
they can't be the only thing that you do.
28:40
You have to look at your whole system.
28:43
and, and that's the,
28:45
that's some of the most difficult work.
28:47
But when you start to see it clicking and your managers understanding
28:51
and your sponsors and you see the system together,
28:54
it really moves the work forward.
28:56
And,, and I think this is a body of
28:58
work that's, we're always five steps forward,
29:00
two steps back, steps forward,
29:02
two steps back. And so I think when you think about
29:04
it from a systemic point of view,
29:06
it allows you to be more agile and to make those pivots
29:10
I believe it allows us to innovate.
29:13
There isn't one way to solve this.
29:17
Deep listening with your employees?
29:19
What do they really need?
29:21
And, and then how do you bring that into a user
29:25
human, human centered design so that you're designing for a more
29:29
inclusive environment versus, you know,
29:31
for, for one set of lived experiences versus another.
29:35
You really have to think about that from a more holistic point
29:38
of view. And I think you have to think about it
29:40
in a number of different ways.
29:41
So we have formal programs,
29:42
we have something called the Warm Line,
29:44
which is specifically to our Black Latinx,
29:47
indigenous LGBT Q plus and women of all races community based here
29:53
and this is a program that we had heard about from
29:56
another company and then we customized for us.
29:59
What how is this going to help us do more organized,
30:02
deep listening, I'll call it and,
30:05
and it was really that understanding of,
30:07
we don't know the commun every community in a deep enough way
30:12
And this was a formal way for us to both advocate
30:16
and support the needs,
30:17
but also on the flip side,
30:19
better understand. And so we know for Latinas,
30:23
the most important topics that come up are around career navigation,
30:26
which we were talking about earlier.
30:29
that relationship. How do you build that trusted relationship with
30:31
your manager? When I think about this work,
30:34
it's, it's not about fixing the Latinas like,
30:36
oh, let's have a program that fixes the Latinas.
30:38
It, it's actually about no,
30:40
how do we fix the system?
30:42
you know, have that partnership with the managers and the employees
30:45
back to that two way street.
30:47
And so how do we better understand that?
30:49
And then the third piece is that experience,
30:52
how do we create that experience?
30:54
And again, those conditions that allow people to be more innovative
30:59
to bring their experiences that they've had both in their careers
31:03
and through their communities.
31:06
I would say with the,
31:07
the Latina community, it's been this very strong connection to community
31:11
and family which is so close to the,
31:14
so many of the sales force values around our volunteer time off
31:18
This is something that we pay our employees.
31:21
you know, over a week's time off every year to
31:23
volunteer in the community.
31:25
And this is something that we hear from many of our Latinas
31:28
that it's really important to them,
31:29
this allows them to give back.
31:31
It's integrated into our jobs and into our work.
31:34
And it's a way that and both they can feel connected to
31:37
their communities. And it's a way that they can get
31:40
connected to their teams and their managers.
31:42
And so there's, you know,
31:43
small, again, small little things along the way that help
31:47
create this better understanding of who we are.
31:50
It also helps expose the team to different cultures and communities
31:56
through the volunteer experience.
31:58
And so I think that's another way that you can share your
32:01
community also back with your team.
32:04
I feel like all your peers,
32:07
any other Chief Equity Officer in a different company must be like
32:10
kicking themselves. Why don't I work in sales force?
32:13
Because I feel like,
32:15
because I feel like you work in a company that just like
32:18
Claudia was saying, it's not like one program here or let's
32:20
add it as the sixth value of the company,
32:23
but it's not really permeating.
32:25
So we have a lot to learn from you.
32:28
I wanna ask you specifically about recruiting and promoting Latinas.
32:32
What, what do you think are specific things and,
32:34
and unique things that companies should be doing to recruit Latina talent
32:39
and to promote them and create the environment for them to thrive
32:42
besides giving opportunities to,
32:45
to stay connected with their community?
32:47
Well, I think part of the work,
32:48
especially from recruiting is how do you meet people where they are
32:52
right? How do you go to the spaces where Latinas
32:55
are and make sure that you're getting to know people and understanding
32:59
And so whether it's through our university programs or through partnerships
33:04
How do we make sure that we really understand and
33:07
are connected to the places where Latinas are.
33:10
I think it's you know,
33:12
yes, there may be ways that they come to sales force
33:14
But we also want to make sure at that sort of
33:16
top of the funnel that we are,
33:18
we want to drive that application volume,
33:21
we really need to make sure that Latinas know who we are
33:26
what we stand for and,
33:27
and why this would be a great place for them.
33:29
And so again, it's how do we create those conditions by
33:33
which they can make connections and one of programs that I'm
33:36
I'm most excited about and is one of our most successful
33:39
programs on the recruiting side is we have a group called Insiders
33:43
And Insiders basically means that when you're in the interview process
33:47
you can talk to somebody inside the company that has a
33:51
common profile to you.
33:53
So if I'm a Latina and I'm interviewing for a job at
33:55
sales force and maybe I'm part of a two parent working
34:00
family. And I want to understand,
34:02
well, how are other Latinas in the company navigating a sales
34:06
role or a technology role?
34:08
I can actually go on to an application and I can search
34:12
through people who inside the company that have volunteered Latinas to be
34:16
insiders and, and in my interview process,
34:19
I can actually have a conversation with them.
34:22
And the point of that conversation is,
34:24
you know, what you see is what you get.
34:25
And so it's meant to be a very candid conversation,
34:28
the good, bad and the ugly of,
34:30
you know, the challenges,
34:31
the exciting things, the opportunities.
34:34
And we find that when we make offers to
34:40
candidates that have gone through the Insider program,
34:43
they accept our offers 100% of the time.
34:47
And so it's a tremendously just that opportunity to really get that
34:51
insight has been so valuable to our candidates.
34:56
And then we also find that it gives the person a connection
34:58
when they start because now they know somebody before they even started
35:02
the company. And so it helps ease that connection as well
35:05
And so that's just one small example of one that
35:09
you know, just again,
35:10
helps people really understand what is it gonna be to meet me
35:14
inside this company before I show up there?
35:16
So you just told us how to recruit Latinas.
35:20
But I want you to tell us why to recruit Latinas because
35:24
Claudia and I have been talking a lot about flipping the script
35:28
about the characteristics that Latinas have that may be seen with one
35:34
And if we show the other side of the coin,
35:36
the same characteristic, it's actually a positive one.
35:39
So why should companies recruit Latinas?
35:42
What are the characteristics associated with Latinas that are good for business
35:46
And and if I may ask since you are a Latina
35:50
and we're very proud to have an incredible Trailblazer like you leading
35:56
the E I for one of the most important tech comp.
35:59
So you're a role model and inspiration for us.
36:01
And for many, how do you as a Latina looking at
36:05
the date of Latinos?
36:06
What are, what do you have you learned about the cultural
36:10
nuances? What is the playbook that you inside of the company
36:13
have? for Latinas being you,
36:15
one probably is closer to you in a more emotional way.
36:18
But like overall, yeah,
36:21
a couple of things that come to mind is,
36:24
you know, you hear a lot of the stereotypes of
36:27
you know, big emotional.
36:31
a lot. Have you heard a lot?
36:39
And one of the things I would say is that in
36:44
you couldn't find me in the internet before.
36:47
I, I think what I've always brought if I use
36:50
myself as an example is this conviction to the role of like
36:54
we're allowed for a reason because we have conviction and we believe
36:59
in what we stand for.
37:02
And I do believe that,
37:06
that what other people might perceive as a sort of big
37:11
and loud. I look at it as we've got courage,
37:14
we've got conviction. And,
37:16
and a lot of times we can be willing to speak up
37:19
when others aren't. And so sometimes I know there's other
37:24
things in, in our culture that may conflict with that where
37:27
you know, the respect for authority or,
37:30
and maybe a deference.
37:32
one of the things that I feel has been very steady is
37:35
this notion of conviction and I think it's,
37:38
and being willing to just say it.
37:41
And and I've seen that a lot.
37:43
And I think it's a really valuable trait.
37:46
I also think this notion of inclusion from the point of
37:51
view of community and connection.
37:54
When I walk into a room of Latinas,
37:57
there is always this warmth that comes through.
38:01
And I think part of it is we come from so many
38:03
different diverse cultures. But we all love to find ways
38:08
to be together. And I think that this is an
38:11
important, you know,
38:12
not losing that when we move into a corporate environment is really
38:16
really important, finding ways to seek each other out and
38:19
support the diversity of our culture.
38:22
And I think is is really important and,
38:24
and something that I think we can all bring to the table
38:29
I think that it is very important that not only we
38:32
know it, that we can transform and flip the script from
38:36
loud to conviction. I love that.
38:38
But do your peers and managers have to know it.
38:41
Do you educate all your managers and peers of Latinos?
38:45
So that they know that,
38:46
that loudness actually, if you flip it could be conviction or
38:49
is that something that you like is not yet done at the
38:53
organizational level as a program?
38:55
So what I would say is like training.
38:57
Yeah. Well, you know,
38:58
funny story. It's I've worked at places that I would
39:02
say were more formal in nature,
39:05
industries that were more formal in nature.
39:07
And I would say there,
39:09
I felt like I had to dial down and felt a little
39:12
less, it was harder,
39:15
to do that code switching and,
39:17
and navigate and, you know,
39:20
you know, in a particular industry for almost 10 years and
39:24
it wasn't until I came to sales force.
39:26
I actually realized how much I had dialed down and conformed when
39:30
I got to sales force.
39:31
We're kind of a big personality kind of company.
39:34
And so I do think we're actually a really fabulous fit for
39:40
the Latinx community because we are about,
39:43
you know, big and being out there and having conviction.
39:48
And so I think there's a lot of values alignment between
39:51
the Latinx community and sales force.
39:54
And so when I first came,
39:56
these are my people like this is,
39:58
this is a space where I can just show up and be
40:01
me. I can wear the crazy tennis shoes or,
40:05
I can wear the bright colors when I'm on stage.
40:08
There was, you know,
40:09
all of these things that I had realized other times in my
40:14
I didn't, I wasn't even conscious of how much I was
40:16
dialing that down until I came into an environment where I didn't
40:19
have to anymore. And what's,
40:20
what do you think is the,
40:22
the impact even like the business impact of having your team dialing
40:29
Can you tell us like,
40:32
Is it good? Should people do it?
40:34
I think it's that whole notion of dialing down and code switch
40:39
companies don't get the full advantage of who you are when you
40:42
feel like you need to do that.
40:45
you know, when you're in a company where you're open and
40:48
we're all in different environments and,
40:51
you know, we all have to navigate.
40:53
If you're in a meeting with the board of directors or with
40:57
investors, you may show up a little differently than,
41:01
if I'm going and doing a town hall with the intern team
41:04
or future force team.
41:05
And so I think in a professional environment,
41:07
you always have to know kind of who your audience is and
41:11
And so I think that's the baseline,
41:14
but then I think depending on the company culture,
41:17
you either have an environment where people can bring who they are
41:22
and show up with the fullness of who they are or you
41:25
can't. And I think each of us as we're looking at
41:27
companies and thinking about where we want to work.
41:30
I think that's something you test for in the interview process.
41:34
and I think it's something that's really important to find
41:38
It took me a long time in my career to figure
41:39
out. Oh, I need values alignment.
41:42
Wherever I go, I need to make sure where I'm going
41:45
I'm not going to have to dial down or I'm not
41:47
going to have to show up differently.
41:49
I need to know more about that.
41:51
So specifically, let's practice in your interview.
41:54
I'm interviewing you, you're interviewing for a job with me.
41:57
How would you test if our values align?
42:01
I'm your potential future boss.
42:02
Hello, Laurie. Laurie Laurie.
42:06
We're a little late.
42:10
I think part of it is,
42:12
I mean, I literally,
42:13
I would say sort of how you're greeted,
42:16
you know, are people smiling at you?
42:19
Are they engaging with you?
42:21
Are they interested? These are things,
42:24
are they interested in me,
42:25
the human, not just me,
42:27
the employee. And so I think also are there senior Latinas
42:34
well, yeah, that's of course an important one for sure
42:36
And I think just the again,
42:38
yes, there's always going to be a level of formality of
42:43
there's something about, do people feel like they can bring their
42:46
humanity to the table?
42:48
And if you can't feel that in an interview,
42:51
I'm not sure you're going to feel it in the job.
42:56
I, my, my family obviously started to hear me
42:59
during COVID, I would be working from home and they'd say
43:03
it sounds like you're laughing all day long.
43:06
I said because, because I have to have joy and fun
43:09
in my job. And so whether I'm in an interview,
43:12
I, I, that's how I show up.
43:14
And so I think for me,
43:15
if I was talking to somebody,
43:17
my future employer, are they asking me questions about?
43:20
I mean, and of course,
43:21
you have to be careful in interviews,
43:24
do they, do they care about who I am?
43:26
Do they care about my community?
43:29
Are they asking questions of curiosity?
43:32
or do I get the impression that they have a very
43:35
specific set of what's right or what's wrong in a certain
43:42
Are they leaving room for innovation?
43:44
And, and I think it sounds like very high level topics
43:48
but there's a lot of nuances that can happen in an
43:51
interview that they kind of show you whether or not someone's
43:54
going to be open or whether or not they're going to
43:58
be more rigid and I think for me as a Latina,
44:02
I, I need that space to be innovative to push the
44:07
envelope, to really think about how we can drive things in
44:11
a much more, in a much bigger way.
44:14
I guess that's how my Latinidad shows up in who I am
44:19
I mean, like this is the first time we're talking about
44:21
this? But do you think,
44:21
I do think that checking whether they are interested on curiosity.
44:29
what is this, what are the values that you have
44:31
so that you can see whether they align to yours?
44:34
Do you have senior Latinas?
44:35
What is this environment for Latinas specifically?
44:38
Like we ask some of those very specific questions about
44:43
like, is this environment inclusive for,
44:45
for Hispanics? I think people don't think that we ever ask
44:49
I never asked that we never even say we're Latinos because
44:53
we're scared of actually coming with our identity forward.
44:56
And I think that that's where that's,
44:57
do you think that those are good questions?
45:00
And in way that you can ask if you are feeling less
45:05
tell me about how you bring your personal value to work.
45:09
I say I see versus a very,
45:11
you know, values driven company.
45:13
How does that show up day to day for you as a
45:16
leader in the organization?
45:17
Is a great way to ask that question.
45:19
When you're interviewing for a job,
45:21
you're also interviewing them.
45:22
That's fine. Like it,
45:24
if they don't like the question,
45:25
that's your answer, that's not the place for you.
45:27
Well, exactly. And in a,
45:29
you know, another question,
45:30
it's,, that I think is really important is like
45:34
if it's important to you,
45:35
what is the company stand for or what does that manager stand
45:39
for? I think it's OK to ask that question.
45:42
You know, some things that are really important to me are
45:46
innovation, you know,
45:48
equality inclusion as a manager,
45:52
you know, what values are important to you and how do
45:54
you bring them to your team?
45:56
That could be a really,
45:58
it's not a it doesn't feel hopefully there's a way that
46:03
people can ask the question and not feel like they're being
46:06
you know, awkward or creating an uncomfortable scenario in an
46:11
interview. I think everybody's looking for companies that align with their
46:15
values and so that can be a way.
46:18
And, and you can decide whether or not you want
46:20
to attribute it to your Latina background or not.
46:23
I think that's up to each individual's personal preference.
46:29
these are the kinds of questions that our insiders get all the
46:32
time because I do think in particular,
46:34
if they don't see a Latina in their,
46:38
in their interview chain,
46:40
it allows them a way to go get the answers that they
46:44
might not feel comfortable seeking through the actual interview and,
46:48
and we don't get notes from the insiders or anything.
46:50
It is literally meant to be a safe space for those kinds
46:53
of questions to be asked.
46:54
I want to go deeper into the identity piece and I want
46:57
to go back to my favorite subject,
46:59
which is Laurie. Let's go there.
47:02
You've mentioned how yourself,
47:05
you had to dial down.
47:08
We also have heard from you know,
47:11
like our guests and we hope that we can bring a wide
47:14
perspective. The community is so diverse.
47:17
We are everything we can be,
47:19
you know, native American Afro Latinos part of LGBT Q.
47:23
And then there's, there's some identity issue that a lot of
47:28
people are feeling about like,
47:30
am I fluent enough in English to be American?
47:32
Am I fluent enough in Spanish to feel Latina?
47:35
Do I claim the Latini that even if I can't,
47:37
do I feel rejected in one or the other as opposed to
47:40
being able to be everything?
47:42
And can you talk about that in your own experience?
47:46
how has that been part of your corporate life as a person
47:51
as Laurie? But also Laurie now as seeing,
47:54
you know, like overseeing so many so many people and
47:57
talent. Yeah, it's a complicated one.
47:59
I'll say I know for myself.
48:01
So I don't speak Spanish.
48:04
it's one of those things where there's always a little bit of
48:07
insecurity, even at my level today,
48:09
there's always a little bit of insecurity of,
48:13
am I enough? Am I representing,
48:17
how are people going to feel if they,
48:19
you know, start to speak to me in Spanish?
48:21
oh, poquito de espanol,
48:23
that's it. That's all I can do.
48:26
And, and so there's always this sort of moment or
48:30
the dreaded question of where are you from?
48:33
And then I say things like,
48:34
well, I'm from San Jose,
48:34
California and you get kind of the cocked look of like,
48:38
no, but where are you really from?
48:40
And you know, I sit there and let,
48:43
let that person be awkward rather than me be awkward.
48:46
I've learned. And it,
48:48
and it, and it's sort of,
48:48
there's all of these little things that happen in your career of
48:53
stereotypes and expectations that people have for you.
48:56
And I think they're outside the community and in the community.
49:00
Exactly what you said.
49:01
I mean, I've definitely walked into spaces where everybody may be
49:04
speaking Spanish or maybe they're sharing a personal story and I feel
49:08
like, OK, I don't really have that type of story
49:13
I have my own story,
49:15
but then you start judging your own story.
49:19
it's an awkward feeling to feel like you have to judge your
49:21
own story. And I would say I didn't share my
49:25
story for many years because I,
49:28
I didn't really know what to say because I didn't feel like
49:31
what I would share was going to be what people expected of
49:34
me. And, and so I just,
49:37
you know, I just sort of conformed and did what I
49:42
and I don't think I even realized it in a very conscious
49:47
I actually had a Latino leader.
49:50
and, and he said to me,
49:52
Laurie, I want you to get involved in our employee resource
49:55
group. And this is probably 15 years into my career
50:01
at this point. And I said,
50:03
oh, no, I've never really gotten involved.
50:07
my experience isn't the same.
50:11
and so we sort of went through these things and he said
50:13
well, I've got a great story.
50:15
You know, I came you know,
50:17
on a boat from Cuba,
50:19
like, I'll cover that part.
50:21
But I think there's a lot of people just like you that
50:26
nobody ever hears that story and they're not showing up because there's
50:30
no one like you telling that story.
50:32
And he said, why don't we go together,
50:34
we'll go to different sites together,
50:36
meet groups of Latinos across Latinx employees across.
50:41
And I bet between us we'll hit a wider mark than if
50:45
just you went or just I went and that was my first
50:48
experience sort of leaning in.
50:51
And I did realize that there were a lot of people
50:55
whose experience was more similar to mine.
50:58
Sort of growing up in a generation of assimilation or just
51:02
again, so many generations had passed things,
51:04
some things were kept and some things were lost.
51:06
And I think I didn't appreciate the value of sharing that
51:10
until I had a leader that was willing to lock arms with
51:13
me and, and help me feel less secure about that
51:16
or less insecure about it to be honest and yeah,
51:20
so it's, it's definitely been a journey personally,
51:23
as well as I think in companies,
51:25
we also have to be very careful not to stereotype or make
51:29
assumptions or, you know,
51:30
ask the dreaded question in a way that makes people uncomfortable versus
51:34
you can ask that question in a way that makes people feel
51:37
very welcome and very excited about where you're from.
51:40
And you can ask it in a way that makes people really
51:42
uncomfortable. And I think,
51:44
you know, having that trusted relationship and that curiosity,
51:47
then we want to share ourselves and who we are.
51:50
And so again, I think there's ways to do that
51:54
that creates that warmth and connection.
51:56
we're all going through our own process of embracing our Latinidad.
51:59
I know Claudia when you moved to the US,
52:02
you also found out you were Latina in,
52:04
in my case. I remember exactly the,
52:11
He, he was my manager and he calls me one day
52:14
literally just to ask me,
52:16
hey, aren't you Latina?
52:18
why? Because I'm looking at our numbers and I don't see
52:22
you, you didn't mark that you were Latina when you were
52:25
hired. So they weren't counting me as a Latina.
52:28
And I didn't identify myself as Latina because I always thought Latinos
52:33
are born in the U to Latin American parents.
52:37
So I thought I'm a foreigner,
52:40
And then, so then he,
52:42
he changed the way that I was categorized and they invited me
52:46
to be an executive sponsor of the Latinx A RG.
52:50
And one of the main problems we had as a Latinx employee
52:54
resource was that we didn't know who were Latinos because people didn't
52:57
identify, identify themselves as Latinos.
53:00
So we're like, are there 100 or 200 in this office
53:06
yeah, that is changing.
53:08
Yeah, I was just going to say it's those artificial rules
53:10
right? And barriers that we create that that actually
53:16
I think take away our ability to be a stronger community
53:19
together. We, we sort of have these artificial rules where
53:22
really it's about, oh no,
53:24
we can, we can come together with so many things we
53:27
have in common and that we can learn from each other.
53:30
You know, I wish we could kind of take away
53:32
some of those barriers sometimes.
53:33
And I think that we are in a very special moment.
53:36
That's why it's so important that we all lean in the way
53:40
that we're doing this podcast,
53:41
the way that you are driving sales force,
53:43
it is because our identity is being reformed,
53:46
the way that history has,
53:48
you know, like a shapen,
53:49
the way in which Mexico in the twenties,
53:52
you know, had a new identity re giving birth with a
53:56
muralist commissioned by President Obregon and Vasconcelos to say,
54:01
like, we don't have to admire the Spanish looking,
54:03
we can admire the worker looking,
54:05
look for Mexico. I think that Latinos are going through this
54:08
change according to the Hispanic sentiment story that we just released.
54:13
There's an incredible trend to Latinidad.
54:15
There's an incredible trend to understanding that that 30% of Hispanics today
54:21
do not speak Spanish.
54:23
you're part of a larger group in the country that are
54:27
right now saying like,
54:28
wait, but that doesn't define my identity or my Latini that
54:32
I can still love my food,
54:35
my culture, my values and be Latina equally if I don't
54:39
speak the language. But there's a trend to Latini that there's
54:42
a trend to more and I think that companies have an incredible
54:45
opportunity of learning of being curious,
54:48
of leaning in to get those cultural nuances.
54:52
we have to know that those values are not a con for
54:56
our career but are a pro if we're able to flip the
54:59
script, if we're able to see how this transition between loud
55:03
means conviction, right?
55:06
What other things do you think that we should flip the script
55:10
I mean, I think part of it is how do we
55:12
embrace each other? I think,
55:15
you know, to your point earlier about like overall moving in
55:18
this direction towards our Latinidad,
55:20
how do we learn from each other?
55:22
Right. Let's have an open conversation because I think there's a
55:25
lot of different ways we show our identity,
55:29
food, culture values.
55:34
there's just, there's so many different dynamics and I think we
55:37
don't spend enough time really leaning in and learning.
55:41
You know, one of the things that I think is
55:43
really important to me personally and I've seen in our communities around
55:46
family and community. And I think this is one of those
55:50
things where it's, how do you flip the script on that
55:53
You can be a great some of our best leaders,
55:56
some of our greatest team leaders bring that community,
56:01
bring that connection, bring that curiosity to the company in
56:06
a way that allows people to feel like they can be themselves
56:10
in the environment. And I think the more we also feel
56:13
comfortable sharing that with our allies and with other folks that
56:20
You start to create that,
56:21
that broader environment. So I think community and family is a
56:24
really important one. And I think it teaches us a lot
56:27
about collaboration and about really driving and leading great teams.
56:33
I think the other piece is,
56:35
you know, really understanding.
56:37
We talked a little bit earlier about through this notion
56:40
of deference to authority.
56:43
And I think this is a space where and,
56:46
and we're so grateful for the opportunity.
56:49
And so I do think for companies there is this lack
56:54
of understanding that when Latinos come into the workforce,
56:58
many of us do feel grateful.
57:00
We are excited to be there.
57:02
We can be the most loyal employees to our leaders and to
57:07
our companies and, and,
57:10
and, and what I want companies to know is don't take
57:12
advantage of that, help those leaders succeed and find those internal
57:16
career opportunities. And I think for us as we have to
57:19
make sure we're willing to use our voice even when it feels
57:23
a little counter culture.
57:25
And then I think for our leaders,
57:28
create those conditions for your employees to say,
57:30
OK, I know there's this cultural nuance.
57:33
How do I help my employee?
57:35
And again, not that we need to be saved.
57:38
But I do think there is a mutual two way street
57:41
of managers being curious.
57:44
how do we step into our own employability.
57:48
And we can still be grateful and,
57:50
and, and excited to be in our companies.
57:53
We shouldn't be embarrassed by that.
57:54
But I also think companies should understand there may be that cultural
57:59
nuance and how do we help our,
58:02
our Latina leaders really move through?
58:05
So that, that becomes a very positive aspect to that connection
58:08
with that leader. I love it.
58:10
OK. 122 last questions.
58:15
if you could go back in time and give yourself
58:17
advice, maybe when you were 2530 years old,
58:21
what would you tell yourself to,
58:22
to make your career,
58:23
either go faster or go better or enjoy it more.
58:28
I would say one of the things I've learned is careers are
58:31
long., and I've learned that there's times when I've
58:35
leaned into my career in times where I've leaned back and in
58:40
the times where I've leaned back have generally been related to family
58:44
whether it was when I had my Children or
58:48
I was supporting my extended family and it didn't ruin my career
58:55
and I think sometimes when you're young,
58:56
you feel like, oh my gosh,
58:58
I can't take, I can't take my parental leave or I'm
59:02
only going to take a shorter time than I'm granted.
59:05
And, and I think for me,
59:06
what I've realized is nobody remembers if you were out for six
59:09
weeks or six months.
59:10
because careers are long and I think sometimes the story we
59:13
tell ourselves is, oh my gosh,
59:15
I'm gonna, I'm gonna take back my career or I've had
59:20
opportunities. I mentioned earlier,
59:22
I had an opportunity to live overseas in Europe and I
59:27
had to make a career decision to leave that company because my
59:30
family, my, my boys were going into high school and
59:33
they really wanted to come back home.
59:35
And so I could take a career opportunity that led me to
59:38
another assignment to another part of the country,
59:41
or I could find a new job and come back home and
59:44
I knew it was going to be a harder road to find
59:47
another company, another job.
59:49
But it was really important for me to have that conversation
59:53
and support my Children in that scenario.
59:55
And so I took a lateral move.
59:58
But here's the funny part of the story that move landed
1:00:02
me at sales force.
1:00:05
And I could not have imagined where my career has gone from
1:00:11
Taking that first leap that I thought,
1:00:13
this is a lateral move.
1:00:18
you know, pay and things that were really important weren't going
1:00:20
backwards, but certainly my scope and my remit starting over a
1:00:24
new company, those things I,
1:00:27
my old self would have thought,
1:00:29
oh my gosh, you're,
1:00:30
you're gonna ruin your career.
1:00:32
My self five years ago was like Well,
1:00:36
I know I'm an amazing leader.
1:00:38
I'm going to make it work however it works.
1:00:39
And if it doesn't work there,
1:00:41
I'll find another place.
1:00:42
And so it was a different kind of confidence going into the
1:00:45
scenario to say my family is important.
1:00:48
I know that about myself.
1:00:50
I'm going to make this choice and wow,
1:00:52
what an amazing writer has been five years later.
1:00:55
I, I never would have guessed it from that moment.
1:00:57
I thought I was stepping back in my career.
1:00:59
So I love that you are playing,
1:01:01
you are playing with the right script.
1:01:03
You are playing with the script of a great leader that has
1:01:06
opportunities and everything will be lining up.
1:01:09
So sort itself out,
1:01:10
it sort itself out and his careers are long.
1:01:14
That's a good one.
1:01:15
So who else do you think that has those experiences,
1:01:21
those nuggets of information that we should bring to the podcast so
1:01:24
that our listeners can do it in half the time?
1:01:29
so many amazing leaders.
1:01:31
I think you all know our ceo of our Slack business
1:01:35
Liani Jones. She is a phenomenal leader,
1:01:39
a technologist. He's worked for some amazing organizations and wow
1:01:45
Is she breaking down doors and,
1:01:46
and driving innovation or slack business?
1:01:48
I would love for you to connect with her if you could
1:01:51
at some point, she's absolutely phenomenal and she's leading a La
1:01:55
Latina Latina style, not denying the self and just like breaking
1:02:00
I think that's an amazing thing.
1:02:02
This has been amazing.
1:02:03
I learned so much from you.
1:02:04
I'm inspired and I'm empowered and I'm gonna go and use all
1:02:08
your playbook, Laurie Castillo Martinez from sales force leading a La
1:02:12
Latina, a la la Latina.
Series